Subject: SD and critical pedagogy

Posted by Paul Newton on 9/13/2011
In Reply To:SD and critical pedagogy Posted by Jaimie Cloud on 9/13/2011

Message:

Jamie,

I don’t understand what you’re trying to ask in 1a. Would you mind rephrasing it?

As for your first question in 1), it seems to me that without more information, one can’t determine which way it will go. This is why we need simulation modeling I think. Building a simulation forces us to have to come up with algebraic relationships, parameter values, and thus strengths of loops. Having to provide a computer with the information it needs to simulate would force one to obtain such information. And once we have built the simulation, we can simulate it, see if it goes the way we might have expected for the specific situation, and if not, use the simulation to help us understand why not. After iterating through this several times, we will be more likely to have discovered “which way it will go” and good reasons why.

Also, maybe I’m dense, but I don’t understand what two results you are asking about in your second question in 1. Would you mind clarifying for me?

I think I can barely give a start to answering question 2. First it doesn’t seem to me to be necessarily true that “once a problem has emerged, it is endogenous.” For example if the sun were to release a huge flare that significantly heated the Earth, this could create a problem for life on Earth, but there is not now any way we could influence the situation, so there is no feedback, and therefore this problem is not endogenous. On the other hand, the endogeneity of problems often depends on the perspective one chooses to take. I think one of the lessons of system dynamics is that we should seek to broaden our perspective, that is, we should seek to broaden the boundaries we consider so that we can endogenize problems that at first appear to us to be exogenous. And once we can do this, we might have to further expand our boundaries in order to be able to endogenize a solution. I’m reminded here of the broadening of generic boundaries that I think Donella Meadows was doing in her article “Leverage Points: Places to Intervene in a System” (http://www.sustainer.org/pubs/Leverage_Points.pdf), especially as she moved from Places 9 thru 5 inclusive, to Place 4, to Place 3, to Place 2, to Place 1.

I’m looking forward to what others might have to say in response to your questions….

Paul